|
|
Post by franco on Dec 14, 2020 19:51:08 GMT
A question for those that have replaced steel 1” threaded forks in the past.
Was/is it common to use several spacers if the steerer is a few mm too long?
My logic is it would make more sense than trying to cut off say 3mm with a hacksaw, or am I missing something?
I’ve seen them on bikes I’ve worked on but usually only one, with a lug that lines up with the groove down the threads.
Thanks.
|
|
Jem
Viscount
?
Posts: 3,390 
|
Post by Jem on Dec 14, 2020 19:59:26 GMT
There is a post somewhere on here where someone discuss this Franco. Sorry I can't remember where, and the search function on the forum isn't much help.
I think from memory they very carefully and skilfully took a hacksaw to it. Not for the faint hearted.
|
|
|
|
Post by oldroadietehachapi on Dec 14, 2020 20:31:26 GMT
If the difference is very small than an extra washer will do.
When cutting a steerer tube, the cut must be very straight; to do it right, you need a few tools. I use a Park saw guide and (if needed) a Park die set. I don't like to use the die set on chrome plated steerer tubes as the chrome is very hard. To thread chrome plated steerer tubes, I first sand off the chrome.
A local bike shop should be (but often are not) able to do the job.
All the Best Jim
|
|
|
|
Post by wheelson on Dec 14, 2020 20:53:59 GMT
A question for those that have replaced steel 1” threaded forks in the past. Was/is it common to use several spacers if the steerer is a few mm too long? My logic is it would make more sense than trying to cut off say 3mm with a hacksaw, or am I missing something? I’ve seen them on bikes I’ve worked on but usually only one, with a lug that lines up with the groove down the threads. Thanks. Spacers are ok unless it’s a show bike. Of course, many of us just want the bike to have a certain “look” and that’s ok too. Just don’t forget to leave enough space for the center pull brake cable hanger! If you decide to trim some off, find an extra threaded locknut (or top cone) that will thread past the end of the fork, that is a nut with no flange at the top. If possible, thread it on upside down as the normal bottom of the nut has a wider smooth surface to go against the hacksaw blade. Thread it past the point of cut as this will straighten any mangled threads as you remove it. If you are removing a significant amount of threads, use two nuts back to back, with a blades width apart. After the cut, clean the surface with a file. Again, don’t forget the cp brake cable hanger. Ask me how I know! Best, John “wheelson” |
|
|
|
Post by brianbutler on Dec 14, 2020 21:59:29 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by franco on Dec 14, 2020 22:11:16 GMT
Thanks everyone, that’s really helpful.
I can’t seem to find any exact size replacement forks for the Colorado, the closest are 3mm longer on the steerer. So I’d definitely try a spacer if I go for them.
Keeping an eye on some chrome ones as well which would definitely need cutting down.
|
|
|
|
Post by wheelson on Dec 15, 2020 0:00:54 GMT
Thanks everyone, that’s really helpful. I can’t seem to find any exact size replacement forks for the Colorado, the closest are 3mm longer on the steerer. So I’d definitely try a spacer if I go for them. Keeping an eye on some chrome ones as well which would definitely need cutting down. Just be careful with replacement forks that have a LONG threaded section in that the stem wedge doesn’t clamp in a threaded section. Yes, I’ve seen it happen and we already have a death fork. 🙄 Best, John “wheelson” |
|
robt
Viscount
Posts: 559
|
Post by robt on Dec 15, 2020 9:51:17 GMT
A question for those that have replaced steel 1” threaded forks in the past. Was/is it common to use several spacers if the steerer is a few mm too long? My logic is it would make more sense than trying to cut off say 3mm with a hacksaw, or am I missing something? I’ve seen them on bikes I’ve worked on but usually only one, with a lug that lines up with the groove down the threads. Thanks. If you can find a spacer(s) to fit the fork satisfactorily, I wouldn’t trim the steerer. My 1999 GT Force came with a low stack 1" JIS headset that was probably common at the time, but is now difficult to source replacements for. The Tange Levin headset's 33.3mm stack height just fits, but is best secured using the original headset’s alloy top nut, which is getting a bit worn. An extra 3mm on the steerer might give me some more choice. Even then, the very luxurious Velo Orange 1" JIS option at 41mm stack height wouldn't come anywhere near to fastening. EDIT: Velo Orange (via Velo Duo) offer this Bell mount for 1" threaded headsets that looks like it might be about 3mm thick. Would this turn your 'problem' into an opportunity to mount a bell on your steerer, saving handlebar space? |
|
|
|
Post by franco on Dec 15, 2020 15:23:14 GMT
Thanks Rob. The bell mount is a good idea and you’ve given me another idea as well! I have a few chrome lamp holders for a 1” steerer that I could utilise. I’ll see how the auction goes on the forks and report back when I know more  |
|
|
|
Post by franco on Dec 22, 2020 14:30:20 GMT
Kind of related... fitting a crown race.
I know Park Tool make a tool for it and I’ve heard of people using a piece of upvc pipe as well but has anyone tried the heat method? Apparently if you put the crown race in the oven for 10 minutes it should just slot into place then retract to a tight fit as it cools.
|
|
|
|
Post by wheelson on Dec 22, 2020 15:02:51 GMT
Franco, do you have the correct race? I sometimes run into those 26.4 vs. 27mm situations. As far as installing, I have one of those Hozan slide hammer type devices. Also, I have some stainless steel industrial pipe flanges that slide down over the fork and the flange can be used to tap the race down around the edge of the flange.
As far as the heat method, I've never tried it, but I know this method is used in reverse to install steel races in aluminum hubs: put the races in the freezer, heat the hub and the races practically fall in. I have a 40 hole rear Campagnolo Record hub that I will be trying this on soon and will report back.
Good luck with the crown race and let us know how it works out.
Best,
John "wheelson"
|
|
|
|
Post by franco on Dec 22, 2020 15:18:48 GMT
Thanks John, yes it’s the original race for the Raleigh Superbe fork.
I’m always on the lookout for methods that doesn’t mean me buying another tool every time a new task arises.
Same with installing the head cups, going to try threaded bar and washers, or a large F Clamp with a piece of wood protecting each cup.
|
|
|
|
Post by wheelson on Dec 22, 2020 15:35:24 GMT
Same here with respect to buying a lot of tools. I have one advantage in that I'm a LLC and can write off tools for business purposes (within reason) on my taxes. I also have accumulated a lot of real and improvised tools since my early 1960's entry into the bike repair business. That said, I love to repurpose tools and to even design my own, especially for one-off situations.
Your idea of the threaded bar, washers, and wood is a good one that I have used as well. It's a much better chance of getting them in there flat and straight rather than just pounding them in. Same for Lambert/Viscount sealed bottom brackets. Pressing yes, pounding no, although I've often been guilty of the latter.
Best,
John "wheelson"
|
|
|
|
Post by brianbutler on Dec 22, 2020 18:07:42 GMT
I agree about the threaded rod and big washers to press the head cups. Regarding the fork crown race, you will find that they run the gamut from loose enough to pull off (and put on) with fingers, to quite snug. To remove, I use a brass punch and work my way around until it falls off the seat. If it is super tight, I start by tapping in a razor blade as a wedge. To install, slide an aluminum or PVC pipe over the steerer and then bump the PVC end against the floor or bench. I do use a special tool for this but it is the same principle. Any pipe softer than the hardened race will work without damaging anything.
Brian
|
|
|
|
Post by franco on Dec 23, 2020 18:38:33 GMT
I’m pleased to say the heat method worked on installing the crown race. Ten minutes in the oven and it just slotted on there.
Another thing worth noting, if you can’t get hold of a piece of pipe, the alloy or plastic tube on a standard vacuum cleaner fits perfectly. This was my backup plan but didn’t need it in the end.
|
|
|
|
Post by brianbutler on Dec 24, 2020 2:03:29 GMT
I’m pleased to say the heat method worked on installing the crown race. Ten minutes in the oven and it just slotted on there. Another thing worth noting, if you can’t get hold of a piece of pipe, the alloy or plastic tube on a standard vacuum cleaner fits perfectly. This was my backup plan but didn’t need it in the end. Congratulations on the crown race. If you are into getting the most out of your household appliances, the dishwasher makes a stellar parts cleaner for lighter work. The crock pot is necessary for heavier cleaning.
Brian
|
|
|
|
Post by franco on Dec 24, 2020 17:25:31 GMT
Hit a problem, the headset will only screw onto the fork so far, not sure if the threads are damaged from the fork being blasted, so don’t want to force it any further.
This one might be a job for the LBS in the new year, I don’t own things like thread chasers or even know if that will solve the problem.
|
|
|
|
Post by brianbutler on Dec 24, 2020 18:27:37 GMT
You might be able to chase the threads with the OLD headset cone. It is probably harder than the lock nut.
Brian
|
|
|
|
Post by franco on Dec 24, 2020 18:45:39 GMT
You might be able to chase the threads with the OLD headset cone. It is probably harder than the lock nut. Brian I had a little go with that, oiling regularly and cleaning, made some progress and will persevere with it over the holiday. |
|
|
|
Post by wheelson on Dec 25, 2020 2:10:12 GMT
You might be able to chase the threads with the OLD headset cone. It is probably harder than the lock nut. Brian I had a little go with that, oiling regularly and cleaning, made some progress and will persevere with it over the holiday. Is this the original fork/headset combination? If not then is it possible that one is BSC/ISO at 24tpi and the other Raleigh 26tpi? I recently ran into this on an old Raleigh when the owner wanted to install a modern external bearing bottom bracket. We ended up running 1.37x 24 BSC taps for a fix. Not easy but doable. Best wishes to all and Merry Christmas to all to whom It applies! John “wheelson” |
|
|
|
Post by brianbutler on Dec 25, 2020 18:11:18 GMT
I had a little go with that, oiling regularly and cleaning, made some progress and will persevere with it over the holiday. Is this the original fork/headset combination? If not then is it possible that one is BSC/ISO at 24tpi and the other Raleigh 26tpi? I recently ran into this on an old Raleigh when the owner wanted to install a modern external bearing bottom bracket. We ended up running 1.37x 24 BSC taps for a fix. Not easy but doable. Best wishes to all and Merry Christmas to all to whom It applies! John “wheelson” Good point John, and Merry Christmas to you. If it's only the new headset parts that don't work then I think the 24/26 tpi mismatch sounds likely but if the parts no longer threads easily, then the threads must have been messed up during finishing.
Brian
|
|
|
|
Post by franco on Dec 25, 2020 18:38:15 GMT
Yes, they are the original parts John. Merry Christmas to everyone as well |
|
|
|
Post by brianbutler on Dec 25, 2020 20:27:06 GMT
Yes, they are the original parts John. Merry Christmas to everyone as well I tried to say "but if the OLD parts no longer thread easily, then the threads must have been messed up during finishing." I tangled up the message during editing. Bottom line, it sounds like the original parts no longer thread so there is probably damage from the blast/coat process, and there are no "new" parts involved. Sorry for introducing confusion.
What a dreary day here today - very warm, windy, and raining all day. It has melted the foot of snow that remained but now my sump pump is running frequently but so far staying ahead. The good news is that all the salt is washed off the roads so the biking season might still have a few days left after all.
Brian
|
|
|
|
Post by franco on Dec 25, 2020 21:49:45 GMT
Yes, they are the original parts John. Merry Christmas to everyone as well I tried to say "but if the OLD parts no longer thread easily, then the threads must have been messed up during finishing." I tangled up the message during editing. Bottom line, it sounds like the original parts no longer thread so there is probably damage from the blast/coat process, and there are no "new" parts involved. Sorry for introducing confusion.
What a dreary day here today - very warm, windy, and raining all day. It has melted the foot of snow that remained but now my sump pump is running frequently but so far staying ahead. The good news is that all the salt is washed off the roads so the biking season might still have a few days left after all.
Brian
That’s what I’m thinking Brian, the blasting process may have taken the high points off the threads. Ive made some slow progress with the original headset cone and I’ll report back on that. Been a nice couple of days here, I’ve injured my knee at work so not done any riding. I broke yesterday though, just had to go out, so I took the Triumph Twenty as it’s easy to step through/mount with a stiff knee.  AB8C169E-4246-4BFC-98A4-B6EE989AC93D by Franco_AC, on Flickr |
|
|
|
Post by franco on Dec 29, 2020 22:48:35 GMT
The Superbe forks are back at the LBS, he’s going to chase the threads. I got it powder coated through them so I think he feels partly responsible for the state of the threads.  A66FD83B-4D10-4A80-9DA9-032FECBD7A19 by Franco_AC, on Flickr |
|
|
|
Post by wheelson on Dec 30, 2020 1:04:14 GMT
The Superbe forks are back at the LBS, he’s going to chase the threads. I got it powder coated through them so I think he feels partly responsible for the state of the threads. A66FD83B-4D10-4A80-9DA9-032FECBD7A19 by Franco_AC, on Flickr Looks like the threads were media blasted but then taped off before paint. Probably not much metal removed but sharp threads blunted, should be ok after being chased. Best, John “wheelson” |
|
