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Post by page21 on Aug 28, 2016 5:17:47 GMT
I recently purchased a bike which was advertised as a Viscount. A bit beat, and worn, most of the decals have disappeared. There are no decals left on the top tube. The seat tube has the remnants of what appears to be the "Viscount" name decal. The down tube has a decal on each side baring the word "Competition." Aside from that, there are no further obvious identifications to the untrained eye. It does have a Sugino triple crankset and Suntour deraillures, which as far as I can tell, found their way on some Viscounts. It does not have the "death fork," since the fork is lugged, like the frame itself, and passed the "magnet test" as well. I've only found one online, but vague reference to a Viscount "Competition" model. So, my question is this... Is anyone aware of such a "Competition" model made by Viscount?  |
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Post by kickstandman on Aug 28, 2016 8:35:35 GMT
"Competition" does not appear to be mentioned in the database of model names on this website: lambertandviscount.online/thread/204/lambert-viscount-models-detail1st, before anything else, if the serial number is under the bottom bracket, perhaps compare that number to the serial numbers listed on this website by Lambert or Viscount though this is not a fail-safe test. We see the serial numbers had quite a range. A model by that name does not seem to be mentioned in any posts by forum members. I've seen chrome tipped forks by Viscount; perhaps find a picture to compare. The colour of this bike looks crimson. I've possibly seen that colour. I thought what I saw was a Lambert. Lastly, perhaps a lug comparison with another lugged Viscount/Lambert frame. |
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Post by page21 on Aug 29, 2016 23:22:15 GMT
Indeed, "Competition" does not seem to appear among the variety of models mentioned. Also, checking the serial number against the others, it appears to be too long. Also it doesn't contain any alphabetic letters as some of them do.  I've taken some shots of the decals, the lugs, and the dropouts, to see if anyone can identify whether or not this may be a Lambert/Viscount frame or not. I'll continue to check them against images on the web in the mean time... the help is appreciated! Seat tube  Downtube      |
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Jem
Viscount
?
Posts: 3,418 
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Post by Jem on Aug 30, 2016 7:09:11 GMT
I can't see anything there that jumps out and says 'Viscount' to me. I would bet a fair amount on money that it isn't.
Sorry I can't be of more help than that.
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Post by sprockit on Aug 30, 2016 9:31:24 GMT
I don't think the bike is a Viscount - the tops of the seat stays are different to anything I've seen before on Viscounts, as is the pattern on the fork crown. The graphics font is also very different to the norm, and the 's' seems turned at 90 degrees to the other characters. The frame number has too many numerical digits - in my experience Viscount frame numbers have six numerical digits, and some also have alphabetical characters.
I may be wrong, but I don't think the bike is a Viscount.
Thank you for asking though, and if you properly identify the make, please let us know.
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Post by cusqueno on Aug 31, 2016 9:52:59 GMT
The frame looks similar to the Taiwanese ones used on some of the Viscount range (Tulsa GL for instance) and the nice gold lining of the lugs was found on those bikes (at least, my gold Tulsa had black lining). But the frames from Taiwan seem to have the attractive metal head badge, not used on any other Viscount bikes (as far as I am aware); and there isn't any head badge on this one - are there any rivet holes?
Also, a drive side photo would be helpful - is there a derailleur hanger integral with the rear drop out, or is it separate? The Taiwan Viscounts had separate hangers - only the more expensive Viscounts had integral hangers. I can't decide if the left hand rear drop out is forged or cut from sheet. Again, the cheaper bikes would not have had forged drop outs. Is it known what components the bike had originally (if they have indeed been changed)?
It is unusual - I think unknown - for any Viscount to have brazed on gear cable stops for stem shifters - and this is on a bike without brazed on pump or bottle mounts; but that doesn't mean the braze-ons weren't added at some time.
The lettering is not a Viscount font that I have ever seen.
So it's a resounding "don't know" from me but, on balance, probably not a Viscount.
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Post by kickstandman on Sept 4, 2016 2:59:33 GMT
Retrobike.co.uk or Bikeforums.net (classic and vintage area) would be the best place to ask for help if you haven't gone there.
Vintage bike enthusiasts love the detective game of "what's this bicycle?"
Besides Raleigh, one wants to find out, who else made a Competition.
Other than that, I tried to consider a few things and it just doesn't come; but maybe someone else might know what this bike is right off.
And I would indeed lean towards it possibly being Asian, Japanese. Seat stays up near the seat area have appeared like that on Japanese bikes, Fujis in fact.
At the same time, I believe I've seen forks like that on European made-bikes.
This truly is a mystery.
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Jem
Viscount
?
Posts: 3,418
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Post by Jem on Sept 4, 2016 8:46:55 GMT
It does look to be the same era as many of the Viscounts though. I have seen a number of Japanese bikes with those big 'flying saucer' rear protectors that you show on the first picture (but has then gone by the last picture), but Peugeot in that era had them too. EDIT- this isn't far off? www.the-climb.net/2010/09/nishiki-competition.html |
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Post by kickstandman on Sept 4, 2016 12:57:13 GMT
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Post by kickstandman on Sept 4, 2016 13:14:10 GMT
Looks like Nishiki made a Competition. Right now, the lettering is different but as said, bikes evolve. The lettering above in the picture after the picture of the serial numbers did make me think of the Nishiki "bamboo" lettering some.  Here are some companies that made a "Competition" brand. (Search pedalroom.com www.pedalroom.com/bikes/search?page=7&q=competition ) Nishiki, Miyata, Olmo, Araya, Zeus, Faggin, Soma, some very nice bikes on display. --------- Sure seems costly for decals. |
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Post by kickstandman on Sept 4, 2016 17:38:52 GMT
Can't help but add,
Make sure it's not the seat they call Viscount. That is the name of a bike saddle company.
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Post by oldroadietehachapi on Sept 4, 2016 19:08:59 GMT
Nishiki, American Eagle, Colnago, Rossin, Raleigh, Fuji, Windsor, Peugeot, KHS, are just a few of the brands that had a road bike named competition. The construction looks Japanese to my eye. The key to the ID may be the seat tube decal. It can't be VIS, if the last letter is an S, then it is oriented 90 degrees different than the V and the I. I am guessing it reads VIN; nevertheless, if the last letter is a N then it is a funny looking one. Perhaps it is a partial decal for a Viner? It does not look like a Viner, but who knows. Cheers Jim  |
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