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Post by siegeworks on May 3, 2016 21:55:18 GMT
Hi Folks, Some of you may remember I had a green 600 ex bike on the go. Its progressing well now but I have hit a snag! Need some advice on fixing a chewed up BB thread. When I got the bike it had a sealed thread-less BB on it. I didn't know why at the time and I destroyed it when removing it as was mostly plastic. Anyway it made sense when I screwed in the crank side fixed BB cup, it all appeared fine until it got close to being in and was obviously wonky! Someone clearly made a mess in the past and I've stumbled into it. It also feels like the BB tube has been trimmed. My other silver 600EX frame has a bit more metal past the joints. Anyone ever experience someone doing this and anyone got any advice on fixing the thread. I'd rather the bike be as original as possible and not install a sealed BB. Chemical metal and re-tapping by someone with some practice is my best hope I think. Cheers!
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Post by cusqueno on May 4, 2016 7:13:05 GMT
Best bet is to find a bike shop with the right equipment to chase out the threads. A DIY method (apart from buying the proper (right and left) taps and a wrench to hold them) is to take a pair of old bb cups and to cut slots at right angles to the thread all around them (hack saw), to make improvised cutters. But the hard bit is to keep them square as you screw them in; and it seems from what you say that might be particularly difficult on this bike.
I wouldn't reject the idea of using a threadless bb. The old Mavic ones are reputed to be good but require an internal chamfer on the ends of the bb shell and, if you go to that length, why not just get the threads fixed? The Prestine ones (eBay search) are relatively cheap to buy new (< £20 IIRC) but quite good quality and are all metal. I don't like plastic to form any part of a bb. One of those would get the bike rolling while you think about a permanent solution. They don't need any special fitting. I have one on my gold Lambert, which otherwise has pretty much the correct Lambert parts. The Prestine bb went in as a temporary measure to get the bike going for DFR1, but it works so well I am reluctant to change it. The correct Lambert bb spindle and cranks, which I now have, have a couple of disadvantages as well ...
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Post by siegeworks on May 4, 2016 9:35:44 GMT
Thanks for the advice. I'll have my eye out for a nice vintage looking chrome threadless BB. Your right it will help me get on with the important things and give me time to sort a more permanent solution. I'm gald you have had positive results with a sealed unit. I've no experience with them, and a strong drive to get everything back to stock (or there abouts!) Making it go again should really be the priority. With any luck my local independent cycle shop might have the tools for a proper fix. Ebay comes in at about £90 if I by the tools in. A bit steep so I'd need to get good at it and start doing it for others!
I'll post some more pics as things progress!
Cheers
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Post by oldroadietehachapi on May 4, 2016 14:02:35 GMT
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Post by sprockit on May 5, 2016 8:10:56 GMT
Local frame builder may offer the thread chasing service, as could a bike shop with a decent workshop.
If that fails, I have access to the required kit, so PM me if you get stuck.
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Post by siegeworks on May 11, 2016 9:50:05 GMT
Thanks for the advice gents, its much appreciated. I've had a look online at my 3 local bike shops that claim (at least) to be up to any any repair. We shall see if any of them have the right tools! Thanks Sprockit for your offer, that is very kind. I will let you know if it I run out of options. In the mean time i Will go down the thread-less route to get things moving, I still need to source the right crank though so if anyone has a spare Shimano 600 crank then please let me know! MKS AR-1/2 pedals as well are needed. Also some 600 hubs and Mavic rims. I'm trawling eBay for anything that's not wildly priced and cursing my inability to get to Eroica this year! there's always a bargain to be had at the jumble! More pics to follow soon! Cheers
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Post by cusqueno on May 11, 2016 10:49:47 GMT
Are you wedded to MKS pedals? I have some pairs of Olimpic 64s you could have. They were standard equipment on many late Viscounts, including my 600ex (swapped out for Shimano 600 pedals - the 'aero' type - probably not right for 1981, but I like them). I confess I have an extra 600ex bb as well, but I have to keep that as a spare for my bike.
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Post by siegeworks on May 14, 2016 22:19:41 GMT
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Post by cusqueno on May 15, 2016 13:40:48 GMT
You can have the pedals for the price of the postage - if I sold them to you I'd feel that I'd have to clean and re-grease them. They feel usable as they are, but would probably benefit from some tlc. If you had a spare 600ex Arabesque left hand brake lever I'd swap for that. I ran into the back of one of the team in a traffic queue on the way to Brighton on Friday and my lever came off worse when it hit the ground. Usable but wonky and needs replacing.
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Post by siegeworks on May 15, 2016 21:01:49 GMT
You're a gentleman and I am most grateful! I'd be more than happy to pay postage. Sorry to hear about your EX, sadly I don't have any EX levers other than the ones currently installed. I will keep my eyes open while surfing ebay though. If I can pick one up and send it your way I will!
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Post by oldroadietehachapi on May 16, 2016 5:44:44 GMT
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Post by cusqueno on May 16, 2016 10:35:22 GMT
There seem to be quite a few 600ex crank sets on eBay UK at the moment. There are two types, with the same cranks but different rings attached. See Velobase for details. One version has Dura Ace rings (or DA-type rings), the other looks nicer - lighter and more modern IMHO - and this is what my 600ex came with. If you are searching, it might be worth checking VeloSaloon They're based in Austria, but ship to the rest of the EU for €12, provided you spend €40 or more, which seems very reasonable. I have used them and the stuff was very good value. But they don't seem to have any Arabesque cranks in at present.
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Post by siegeworks on May 16, 2016 12:16:33 GMT
Thanks for the advice guys. Jim, its funny you should say they are perceived to be made of gold. There are a couple of gold ones for sale at the moment! I cant find the more shiny one any more but someone has had a go at this one! www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SHIMANO-600-EX-ARABESQUE-FC-6200-CRANK-ARMS-/262244952380?hash=item3d0f04693c:g:GmwAAOSwUV9Wm293I appreciate the advice on the lookalikes but I think I need the real deal. I too have also wondered why there are a bunch of single arms. I'd collect them and make a set or 2 if a single arm wasn't also up at a silly price. The sellers must realise they are selling a fairly redundant part without the other arm! Sell them cheap would be my advice
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Post by oldroadietehachapi on May 16, 2016 14:16:38 GMT
I appreciate the advice on the lookalikes but I think I need the real deal. I understand your decision. Sadly, maintaining purity and originality has a price. Cheers Jim
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Post by siegeworks on Jun 11, 2016 22:11:42 GMT
Just picked up the crank at last. I stalked eBay until I got one for only 15 quid! No chain rings but I cant moan about the price or the condition. Will add a pic shortly.
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robt
Viscount
Posts: 559
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Post by robt on Jun 13, 2016 17:13:56 GMT
If you had a spare 600ex Arabesque left hand brake lever I'd swap for that. I ran into the back of one of the team in a traffic queue on the way to Brighton on Friday and my lever came off worse when it hit the ground. Usable but wonky and needs replacing. Cusqueno, I've just noticed that Spa Cycles are showing something very similar as a stock item @ £18 for band-on pair. Worth buying while they have them?
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Post by cusqueno on Jun 13, 2016 17:24:53 GMT
That's amazing, particularly as you'd be lucky to get a grungy used set of 600 Arabesque shifters on fleaBay for £18. Unfortunately my problem is with a brake lever. I've more or less straightened it out and I've bought an old pair. I should be able to combine the best bits from two and make a reasonable lever out of them.
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robt
Viscount
Posts: 559
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Post by robt on Jun 13, 2016 22:37:04 GMT
Oh yes. I must try harder at my reading lessons.
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Post by siegeworks on Jun 24, 2016 15:12:13 GMT
Ok so the bad news is local bike shop says the BB threads have had it. I still think that Chemical Metal can save the day but at the risk or ruining the frame totally I better get a threadless BB. The question now is do I go cheap and get a YST (£18) or do I go pricy and get a Velo Orange? (£50) Anyone got experience of either? Also should I buy these wheels? They would be perfect but I cant help thinking £70 is way to much. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/182149415156?_trksid=p2060353.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
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Post by siegeworks on Jun 24, 2016 21:46:52 GMT
I came home to find all the parts to my crank had arrived. Here is my Shimano 600 crank now complete with chain rings. I also stripped and rebuild the original crank the bike came with which is next to it. This one is a Campagnolo Gran Sport.
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Post by siegeworks on Jul 4, 2016 9:09:09 GMT
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Post by cusqueno on Jul 4, 2016 11:27:27 GMT
Looking very good Chris. I'd be interested in a second set of decals to keep in reserve for my 600ex. I've suffered a series of mishaps with it recently, although non affecting the paint or decals. After the crash that bent one brake lever and rear wheel (both now straightened) one pedal dropped a lot of balls and needs to be rebuilt. I replaced it with a 105 pedal, but that fell off while i was pedalling, 'cos I hadn't tightened it enough, causing a bit of damage to the thread and my ankle. Also that pedal's bearings are shot so I replaced this morning with a pair of SunTour Superbe pedals only to get ominous creaking noises from the cranks / bb, despite tightening. Must check before I ride home.
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Post by siegeworks on Jul 5, 2016 9:09:11 GMT
Sounds like your've been through the wars with yours. I had a mishap just last night. I rode to the shop to get some milk. When pulling up at my house I took one foot out of the clips to put on the ground but as i did so the other foot popped out. I lost a shoe and I went arse over tit. I have since learned not to go out in unsuitable cycling footwear. I bent my break lever but nothing a pair of mole grips couldn't sort out! The cuts on my hands and my damaged pride (my neighbour saw me) are another thing all together, ha ha.
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