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Post by triitout on May 22, 2014 15:15:13 GMT
I remember reading an article on Sheldon Brown's site regarding compatability. Bottom line, while not ideal it never gave him a problem on his own bikes but he did'nt interchange on customers bikes.
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Post by stoatie on May 22, 2014 15:57:03 GMT
Back on the road woohoo. Just need the heavy showers to stop and let me out and play.
From what I can gather the 2nd gen porthole cranks (tapered rather than straight) are TA Specialites Touriste cranks re-branded as Viscount with their own chainrings. This would mean that they are an ISO taper, much like the stronglight 99 that I've just fitted.
ISO cranks onto a JIS spindle seems to work it just doesn't quite seat as far on, sticks out about 4mm further. Where as a JIS crank going onto an ISO spindle would go on to far and it would effectively bottom out before it would tighten up fully.
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Post by stoatie on May 22, 2014 16:05:06 GMT
I'm going to order one of these once I've got a bit of spare money and check the spindle size on that. The problem nowadays is finding an ISO taper the right length as the only people who seem to make one is campagnolo and they just don't make them long enough. |
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Post by cusqueno on May 22, 2014 16:09:11 GMT
I've just looked up the thread and according to that the original Lambert crank needs an ISO taper, not JIS. Klein spindles are JIS. It can be fitted, but with lots of hammering and I'd like to avoid that. Asked Steve and am waiting for a reply. Seems Phil Wood it has to be. Hi. I've just looked up some words of wisdom that I e-mailed to someone a couple of years ago. I think I subsequently put them on my blog. What I say was probably largely gathered from exchanges with Steve. 'Ere tiz: 'It is not necessary to use a Viscount replacement spindle, although these are occasionally sold on auction sites and found at cycle jumbles. Other manufacturers have made compatible spindles, for instance Klein, who used an arrangement remarkably similar to Viscount on some of their bikes. Ideally, you want one about 120 or 121mm long to maintain the chain line with the existing chain set. Square taper. Early Viscounts and Lamberts used a non-standard taper (in fact very early Lamberts used one with no taper at all, but that’s another story), later ones seem to have the standard JIS taper and will work with most square taper cranks. Other manufacturers’ spindles may not have Circlip grooves. If there is another method of location provided (such as collars), fine, otherwise fix the spindle in place with an appropriate grade of Loctite. Experience suggests that this is sufficient.' |
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Post by Stella on May 22, 2014 17:26:31 GMT
So in short: Klein spindles will work?
Here's another piece Steve wrote on the CTC:
'Viscount actually made 4 different bottom bracket spindles for the Aerospace frames! The most commonly used spindle had an ISO taper and was recognisable by having 3 grooves machined in it (2 on one side). This spindle accepted Viscount cranks (TA copy, made in England by Birmalux) and very early Shimano, Sugino, SR Apex ones too, although getting the last three to sit square on the spindle is harder than building a space shuttle. Whilst drunk. Also, as I know to my cost getting the original Viscount cranks to sit square on a JIS taper is very difficult. I managed it by fully tightening up the crank/chainrings as normal, locating where it was not sat square and hitting it hard from the back of the chainrings to literally force it back into position, square on the crank. It took me an hour but it eventually sat just nice.
Also, old Klein spindles are still out there. I use one on an Aerospace Pro. It is 123mm long, 17mm diameter and has a JIS taper. A nice quality part. Good for at least 100,000 miles!'
The Klein Spindles are square taper ones.
Edited to add: the spindle with the three grooves was the one for the port hole chain ring, therefore ISO taper.
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Post by velocipete on May 22, 2014 17:44:03 GMT
Steve's right about the chainset being a copy of the TA.Except,it's made of cheese,were as the
TA was made of a decent grade alloy.
And,especially for Stella,"don't ask how I know this"!!!!
Cheers,
Pete.
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Post by Stella on May 22, 2014 17:47:12 GMT
I have a fair idea how you may have found out. lol
I'm just miffed that it seems I can't use the Klein spindles for the port hole chain ring.
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Post by velocipete on May 22, 2014 17:51:56 GMT
Actually you probably can.ISO chainset will go on a JIS taper.Just need to be careful
that it doesn't go too far down the taper so that it can't tighten up.
I wont say the "usual",check Sheldon!
Cheers,
Pete.
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Post by Stella on May 22, 2014 17:54:58 GMT
Actually you probably can.ISO chainset will go on a JIS taper.Just need to be careful that it doesn't go too far down the taper so that it can't tighten up. I wont say the "usual",check Sheldon! Cheers, Pete. I know, but it's not a perfect fit. Will order them anyway. If they don't fit, it's Phil Wood and the Klein for the SR or other chain rings. There, sorted! |
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Post by velocipete on May 22, 2014 19:04:22 GMT
I'll be bringing a couple of bb spindles,2 circlip grooves,to DFR2,and an Apex 52/42 chainset.
All threads are good,teeth good.Other bits and bobs as I find them.
If anyone can make good use of them,they're yours!
Cheers,
Pete.
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Post by Stella on May 22, 2014 19:08:32 GMT
Ha! You're having them stashed away? Doh! Had I known I'd have got in touch, they're exactly what I need for Joseph's bike. Fancy selling one to me?
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Post by velocipete on May 22, 2014 21:00:28 GMT
The usual rates obviously apply! Can you wait to DFR2 or do I have to start looking for packaging?
Let me know what you need and I'll try and sort it.
Cheers,
Pete.
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Post by Stella on May 22, 2014 21:18:26 GMT
The earlier the better, to be honest. I need one spindle with three grooves as he'll fit the Lambert chain ring and five speed at the rear. If possible with circlips, if not I can get some elsewhere. I'm bringing his frame to the powder coaters tomorrow and collect it next week. I'll also have to talk to the decal people, but he's quite keen to get going. (He's Koof on here.)
The frame, by the way, is a Lambert, Steve's 100% sure.
I've sent you a PM.
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